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PetsitUSA Blog

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Why your Labrador isn’t going to be a good livestock guardian

A recent discussion popped up on Facebook this morning in which a member of a homesteading group bragged about what a good livestock guardian and hunting dog his Labrador was. This post got posted in a livestock guardian breed group, which resulted in much, much eye-rolling.

It is certainly true that there are dogs that make excellent livestock guardian dogs that aren’t of the typical breeds. Mark Derr has written extensively about the mongrel dogs of the Navajo that guard their sheep, but within those dogs, there is quite a bit of variance about which ones are good at the task and which ones would rather go roaming and hunting.

The breeds that have undergone selection for this work are much more likely to be successful. All these breeds have been selected for high defense drive and low prey drive. Little lambs can go jumping around these dogs, and their instinct to hunt and kill prey will not be stimulated.

Most dogs bred in the West are bred for the opposite behaviors.  The most popular breeds are usually from the gun dog and herding groups, and those breeds tend to have been selected for relatively high prey drive. Those dogs are much more likely to engage in predatory behavior towards them.

Further, breeds like Labradors are bred to have low defense drive. Labradors are very rarely good guard dogs. They have been bred to fit in the British shooting scene where they would regularly be exposed to other dogs and strangers, and these dogs have had much of their territorial and status-based aggression bred out of them. If the coyote shows up to a farm guarded by a Labrador, chances are very high that the Labrador will try to play with the coyote. It might bark at the coyote and intimidate the predator as well, but there aren’t many Labradors that are going to fight a coyote that comes menacing the flock.

The poster with the LGD Labrador claimed that Labradors were great herding dogs. When pressed on this point, he posted a photo of some yellow dogs moving a herd of beef cattle. These dogs weren’t Labradors. They were blackmouth curs, a breed that can superficially look like a Labrador, but it is a hunting and herding breed that is quite common parts of the South and Texas.  You could in theory train a Labrador to herd sheep, but I doubt you could ever train one to herd cattle. And the herding behavior would be far substandard to a breed actually bred for it.

The poster claimed that Labradors were “bred down from Newfoundlands,” and Newfoundlands are livestock guardians. The problem with this statement is that it is totally false. As I’ve noted many times on the blog, the big Newfoundland dog was actually bred up from the St. John’s water dog. Every genetic study on breed evolution, clearly puts this breed with the retrievers. This dog was mostly created for the British and American pet market, but it is a very large type of retriever.

And contrary to what I have written on this blog, it is now clear that retrievers and Newfoundlands are not an offshoot of the livestock guardian breeds.  A limited genetic study that also found Middle Eastern origins for all dogs had this finding, but a more complete genetic study found that retrievers and the Newfoundlad are actually a divergent form of gundog.

dog breed wheel newfoundland

I have not written much about this study, but it does change some of my retriever history posts. It turns out that Irish water spaniels are also retrievers and are very closely related to the curly-coated retrievers. It has been suggested that curly-coated retrievers are actually older than the St. John’s water dog imports, but conventional breed history holds that they are crosses between St. John’s water dogs and some form of water spaniel. It may actually be that something like a curly-coated retriever is the ancestor of the St. John’s water dog, and this dog would have been called a “water spaniel.”  I have not worked this one out yet. The dogs we call Newfoundland dogs, though, are much more closely related to the Labrador, flat-coated, and golden retrievers than to the curly-coated retriever and the Irish water spaniel. Thus, the Labrador and the Newfoundland dog are cousins, but the Labrador is not “bred down from the Newfoundland.”

The other clue that Newfoundland dogs and their kin aren’t good LGDs is that in Newfoundland, the sheep industry was actually severely retarded by the dogs. Fishermen let their dogs roam the countryside, and any time someone set out a flock of sheep, the water dogs, which I would call St. John’s water dogs, would descend upon the flocks and savage them.

So the natural history of the Labrador totally conflicts with its likely ability to be a good livestock guardian. The British bred these dogs to be extremely social, and their prey drive has been selected for.  They also have this entire history in which their ancestors went out hunting for their own food, which means they do have the capacity to become sheep hunting dogs.

The poster didn’t appreciate when these facts were pointed out. The response was that the other people were racist for saying that Labrador isn’t likely to be a good LGD, especially a Labrador that has been used for hunting.

This is problematic because dog breeds are not equivalent to human races. Human races are just naturally occurring variations that have evolved in our species as we have spread across the globe. Most of these differences are superficial, and none are such that it would justify any racial discrimination in law or policy.

Dog breeds, however, have been selectively bred for characteristics. The eugenics movement, the Nazis, and the slaveholders who selectively bred slaves are the only people who have engaged in the selective breeding of people. And all these periods in history have lasted only a very short time before they were deemed to be gross violations of human rights.

For some reason, people have a hard time accepting these facts about dogs, but the very same people often have no problem with an analogy with livestock.

If I want high milk yields, I will not buy Angus cattle. If I want marbled beef, I won’t buy Holsteins. If I want ducks to lay lots of eggs, I wouldn’t get Pekins, which will lay about 75 eggs a year. I would get Welsh harlequins, which might lay 280 a year. But they don’t get very big, and their meat yields are very low.

Angus cattle and Holsteins are the same species. Welsh harlequins and Pekins are too. But they have been selected for different traits.

Dogs have undergone similar selection. A Labrador retriever has its own history. So does a Central Asian shepherd.

Accepting that these dogs have different traits does not make one a racist. It merely means that one respects the truth of selective breeding.

And that’s why a Labrador isn’t really a good LGD.


Natural History

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The Scoop On Grain-Free Dog Food

Dog Eating Food

“Grain-free” is often a distorted concept in pet food, even though some dog owners believe that pet food identified this way is of special value. “Grain-free” pet foods were developed and marketed in response to what people were seeking, perhaps as part of a human dietary trend to avoid carbohydrates, rather than the actual nutritional needs of dogs.

 What Does Grain Free Actually Mean?
In grain-free dog foods, ingredients such as potatoes or rice replace the grains in the food. Often these ingredients have more carbohydrates than the grains used in dog food, or in the case of potatoes have a glycemic index which has its own effects (as any human diabetic will know).

There is also the sim-identification by most people who include corn as a “grain” to be avoided, when corn is not a grain – as anyone on a gluten-free diet can attest. A side note is that corn is actually a really nice food source, whether for people or dogs (not cats, who should be getting barely any carbohydrates from any source!) but that is a story for another day.

Blaming Grains for Medical Problems
I am concerned that pet owners go to “Dr. Google” or chat with friends and come up with their own diagnoses and remedies for their pets’ illnesses.

I received a question from a lady about her Cavalier King Charles Spaniel, who began having seizures when he was 6 years old. She said that after hours of googling on the internet she found that corn (sic) and wheat were the probable reason, even though she had him on a premium dog food. She switched to a grain-free food and he never had another seizure, for which she credits the removal of grains – clearly without knowing that corn is not even a grain!

In any case, seizures are most likely an inherited genetic trait, or related to a medical condition. There is no logical way to tie seizures to any sort of pet food, nor to attribute the cessation of symptoms in two mere weeks to changing foods.

So is It Good to Feed Grain Free Food?
For me, it’s not really a concern that people are making a choice for “grain-free” without fully understanding what they are getting. They are surely getting nice quality foods that are made without grain – so all to the good. I will say that people have a misconception that they are getting a ‘carb-free” free at the same time, as mentioned above. All dry foods need carbohydrates to be manufactured. While there might not be “grains” like wheat, all kibble, grain-free included, necessarily has “carbs” of various kinds, whether it’s rice, potato, or a similar binder.

If Grain Free Isn’t “The Answer” Then What Is?
We all have a dizzying array of premium and “super premium” (whatever that means, quite honestly?!) foods to choose from. So how do we pick and choose in a way that makes us feel comfortable about the philosophies of the company we are supporting with our purchase, and the thought that goes into what their ingredients are and where they source them.

I guess this explains why I’m so happy about my personal choice of using Halo dry food for my dogs. It has been a wise one from those perspectives, since their commitment to giving back to shelters has been there from the beginning, and using only whole meat and no animal byproducts or rendered meal. They have recently gone one step further to choosing meat that is American-sourced, humanely raised and without growth hormones or antibiotics, along with non-GMO fruits and vegetables. In addition, I feed the canned varieties of Halo Stews made of salmon, lamb and chicken.

My dogs also eat dehydrated foods as part of their daily diet, which also contain whole meat (and also never any meat meals). These foods have also been proven to be more “bioavailable,” with the dog’s body able to absorb more nutrients because they are highly digestible, as is Halo.

I’d recommend that you should find also find companies that make “top shelf” foods and also have a heart and conscience.

Tracie HotchnerTracie Hotchner is a nationally acclaimed pet wellness advocate, who wrote THE DOG BIBLE: Everything Your Dog Wants You to Know and THE CAT BIBLE: Everything Your Cat Expects You to Know. She is recognized as the premiere voice for pets and their people on pet talk radio. She continues to produce and host her own Gracie® Award winning NPR show DOG TALK®  (and Kitties, Too!) from Peconic Public Broadcasting in the Hamptons after 9 consecutive years and over 500 shows. She produced and hosted her own live, call-in show CAT CHAT® on the Martha Stewart channel of Sirius/XM for over 7 years until the channel was canceled, when Tracie created her own Radio Pet Lady Network where she produces and co-hosts CAT CHAT® along with 10 other pet talk radio podcasts with top veterinarians and pet experts.

Dog Film Festival - Tracie HotchnerTracie also is the Founder and Director of the annual NY Dog Film Festival, a philanthropic celebration of the love between dogs and their people. Short canine-themed documentary, animated and narrative films from around the world create a shared audience experience that inspires, educates and entertains. With a New York City premiere every October, the Festival then travels around the country, partnering in each location with an outstanding animal welfare organization that brings adoptable dogs to the theater and receives half the proceeds of the ticket sales. Halo was a Founding Sponsor in 2015 and donated 10,000 meals to the beneficiary shelters in every destination around the country in 2016.

Tracie lives in Bennington, Vermont – where the Radio Pet Lady Network studio is based – and where her 12 acres are well-used by her 2-girl pack of lovely, lively rescued Weimaraners, Maisie and Wanda.

Halo Pets

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Surf City Surf Dog Competition, Sept. 23

The days are getting shorter, and soon the totally tubular tail-waggers who love to hang eight will have to hang up their surfboards until surfing season rolls around again. Before that happens,…



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DogTipper

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Minimalism

I’m part of a group on flickr that gets a challenge every 2 weeks… This time around the challenge is minimalism.  So off Coulee, Marlin and I went to the university where there is a pretty cool sculpture thing I thought we could use.  It is nothing like what I normally shoot, but I quite like it!

Crazy Coulee and Little Lacey

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